QUESTION: Jesus commands us to tell others - Why me? (3558 views, 382 replies)
master
32 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven. 33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.
Matthew 10:32-33
master
That's a parable.
biblehub.com/greek/2695.htm
It's talking about the judgment after death and being sent to Gehenna as the person rejected the grace of Jesus Christ.
Obviously YOU do have a choice called free will. You just have to live with the consequences.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Bless you Dear Brother AnhedoniaNightmare, you are right Jesus always gives us all free choice just like the choices we make in every day Life. Those choices all have consequences just like Brother AnhedoniaNightmare said.
@Aleciaandbobby 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Romans 10:9
Right this second, anyone who has not committed Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit can be immediately saved.
Why would anyone in their right mind...resist?
@AnhedoniaNightmare Because they can't be in their right mind maybe, because if they were in their right mind they would not resist the truth!
@Aleciaandbobby Atheism is absolutely illogical. There is no way to justify it.
Now people could justify just about any spiritual system or
agnosticism without much difficulty but I'll not help them by explaining how.
This is the central issue with debate as a good debater can justify anything. So right away that makes the search for veracity problematic.
What I have told people to try over the years is to sincerely pray to the TRINITY and ask for acceptance of their willingness to try. And then see if they get answers.
You lose nothing by trying.
member
DEUTERONOMY 25:11-25:12
If two men, a man and his countryman, are struggling together, and the wife of one comes near to deliver her husband from the hand of the one who is striking him, and puts out her hand and seizes his genitals,then you shall cut off her hand; you shall not show pity.
CAN SOMEBODY EXPLAIN THIS MADNESS?
@NinjaBoyOne Blessings BlackMagneto,
Deuteronomy 25:11
When men strive together one with another, and the wife of the one draweth near for to deliver her husband out of the hand of him that smiteth him, and putteth forth her hand, and taketh him by the secrets:
Deuteronomy 25:12
Then thou shalt cut off her hand, thine eye shall not pity her.
Here's the explanation :
Verses 11, 12. - But though the childless widow might thus approach and lay hold on the man, no license was thus granted to women to pass beyond the bounds of decency in their approaches to the other sex. Hence the prohibition in these verses. The severe sentence here prescribed was by the rabbins commuted into a fine of the value of the hand.
@Aleciaandbobby And that was rarely enforced and now has been done away with due to Jesus dying on the cross!
@NinjaBoyOne Maybe you should actually read the Bible before criticizing it? Don't you think?
Do you criticize Shakespeare before you read it? Do you criticize Socrates before you read it?
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1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
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@AnhedoniaNightmare The problem of @BlackMagneto reading the Bible would mean that there might be some learning of the truth.
@AnhedoniaNightmare also just thought of this but you believe in genesis right? or do you only believe in certain parts of the bible? because that's in the old testament if i remember correctly.
@NinjaBoyOne Blessings BlackMagneto, you can't believe in just certain parts of the Bible if you are truly a follower of Jesus you believe in 100% of the Bible! I am a follower of Jesus Christ and I know that I believe 100% as does my brother AnhedoniaNightmare!
member
OR MAYBE THIS ONE?
TIMOTHY 2:11-2:12
11 - A woman must quietly receive instruction with entire submissiveness.
12 - But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet.
IS THIS REALLY JESUS'S WORD? CUZ THAT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE LOVING ALL YOUR LITTLE CHILDREN TO ME.
@NinjaBoyOne Who are you to judge the actions of the TRINITY?
Imagine a BEING that is all powerful, all knowing, who created the universe, possibly universes(multiverse theory).
How can you judge such a being? The difference in your power and knowledge and the TRINITY is greater than a single celled organism and you.
member
I recommend the Zeitgeist movies...and this one : Caesar's Messiah: The Roman Conspiracy to Invent Jesus (2012)
@NinjaBoyOne I've seen 2 of the Zeitgeists but not Caesars Messiah, I'll hafta give it a watch.
Thanks for the mention dude!
@mrkim56 There is no historical evidence that Caesarion, the son of Julius Caesar and Cleopatra was Jesus of Nazareth.
ROFL
@AnhedoniaNightmare the flavian dynasty paid the greeks to write the bible to hide that the romans were doing it. So they could rebrand the roman religion of mithraism as christianity and sell it to the people thus bringing romes economy back from ruin. the reason for the vatican. you have no idea if ceasars son was jesus or not. no one does . they discover new things all the time. what they have never discovered anything that can definitevely be linked to a man known as jesus christ...funny coincidence no one ever knew what happened to ceasar and cleopatra's son.
@NinjaBoyOne You do realize historians mock this conspiracy theory, right? It's a kooky idea that is ridiculed by historians.
There are more primary sources about the Bible by FAR than any other writing. Look it up.
master
You are being deceptive.
22 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.
25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; 26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, 27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish. 28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself. 29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church: 30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.
31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh. 32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church. 33 Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.
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@AnhedoniaNightmare The passage is lovely but demanding by far for the husbands. The romantic intimacy is a metaphor for the loving relationship between Christ and the church. It's about sacrificing all. That is not required for the wives.
guru
Numerous times I've been asked "If you had the power to do only one thing to change humanity for the betterment of all, what would it be?"
The answer is simple, the elimination of all religion from the face of the earth.
No other force has so severely impacted mankinds progression, been more divisive, visited more pain, suffering and death upon humanity as has religion.
As one who loves my fellow humans I simply cannot embrace any religion for the above reasons.
I wholeheartedly embrace people of faiths right to believe as they so choose and all I ask in return is acceptance of my own right to not embrace any of them.
@mrkim56 Blessings mrkim56,
Here's what might give you a better understanding of what I think is the problem with Religion. The Controversy about religion really seems to be something that stirs controversy because it attempts to define God. Some groups freely choose to sacrifice their lives in the name of their religion, while others vehemently fight to exclude religion from their government, schools, and society.
“There is only one religion, though there are a hundred versions of it”
(George Bernard Shaw’s Plays Pleasant and Unpleasant).
If this is true, then a definition of religion must be a broad one. How does an individual choose from the array of belief systems which offer Polytheism, Cults, Paganism, New Age, Mormonism—and hundreds more?
Religion - The Burden
What a strange journey the practice of religion offers mankind. In every culture, whether primitive or civilized, there are “god-seekers.” Imperfect man strives to explain his purpose and his world through a pursuit of some higher power.
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@Aleciaandbobby Thank you for your explanation and having taken the time to expound on your views on my behalf :>)
master
What a contradiction! First you say you want to eliminate all religion...
...then say you embrace people of all faiths!
ROFL
master
What if you commit Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit? That cannot be forgiven.
22 Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw. 23 And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David? 24 But when the Pharisees heard it , they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.
25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: 26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? 27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. 28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.
29 Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house.
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guru
There is absolutely no contradiction in what I said above.
It's only a fantasy that I could remove all religion, though in the answer to the question posed, that would be my solution.
I did not say I embrace all religion, though I did say I respect all believers their right TO believe how they so choose, which is quite different.
@mrkim56 I wholeheartedly embrace people of faiths right to believe as they so choose and all I ask in return is acceptance of my own right to not embrace any of them.
Your words.
And now, this is rich, you admit to fantastical thinking!
ROFL
@mrkim56 it is a good idea to end all religions. you are right about that. Nature is the only God people should be worried about.
@NinjaBoyOne Prove what you just asserted with logic and evidence. The burden of proof is on you.
I recommend you take at least three philosophy courses. If you had, you would not be failing so miserably by making undisciplined statements.
You are young. There is still time to remedy this. All is not lost.
guru
Amazing how obtuse some folks can be. Even when reiterating a point word for word made by another and still finding comprehension of those words to be ... incomprehensible 
@mrkim56 Well don't act like a liberal and speak in gobbledegook contradictions.
I was getting impressed by your command of politics too.
By the way, historians break into peals of laughter and start guffawing when some student discusses Caesarion as Jesus of Nazareth. That is crazy talk.
guru
Should anyone find contradiction in what was stated by me above I'd reckon the problem lies between what's been read and the logic circuits used to make the interpretation.
@mrkim56 I understand what you said. You embrace their RIGHT to believe as they choose. You don't embrace their faith. Pretty obvious if you ask me.
@mrkim56 How is it that an intelligent conservative cannot see the contradiction.
Insert "atheist" into your post. It makes no sense.
You cannot ban atheist thought and then say you support atheist ideas even if you disagree with them.
guru
When I was a little girl my father proclaimed to be an atheist. He said no loving God would allow the things to happen that he saw during the war. I was little, maybe six or seven.. but I knew he was angry with God and if you are angry with him then you are not an atheist. Someone that truly does not believe he exists is not angry at him or those that do believe. What does not exist, is not an issue.
Concerning what this thread is about.. The following is my opinion. We are suppose to live Godly lives so those that do not believe will want to. We are not to argue our point of view for those that do not want to hear it it just makes it worse. It's a fine line and we should pray for wisdom.
@laurie621 Thank you my dear as you've made my point quite eloquently for me :>)
Many folks, particularly theists, seem to point to atheism as a belief itself, which it isn't.
Denial of belief in all concepts of a god, is hardly a belief as it's quite simply a shunning or rejection of all religion in totality.
Now there are indeed atheist gatherings and centers, hell, honestly I don't even know what they'd be called.
I view these as an absolute oddity in my own thoughts, as if they need to band together and jointly show their disbelief in a god. I expect some of them do so as a method of validation for their ideology, which again seems quite strange.
My thoughts are my own and I need no type of outside validation to justify them to myself, or honestly, to anyone else. So, the idea of an atheist gathering of any sort just seems quite silly:>/
@DemandingFemale That may well be true and so long as I'm bringin the RUM, it'll damned sure be one when I get there!
I suppose we could all toast to the great flying spaghetti monster :>P
@mrkim56 That is a clear examply of an appeal to ridicule fallacy. Atheists so frequently use it that philosophers actually use your example.
You are failing and that makes zero sense as I KNOW you well spoken at times to the point of eloquence when discussing politics.
@mrkim56 They all are angry at someone they insist does not exist, as I said before. I do not believe there could be any other conclusion... They are so mad they have to thumb their noses and make noise about it. Seems many feel the need to recruit as many as possible and call names and ridicule those that dare to believe God loves them.
@laurie621 That's certainly a reasonable conclusion.
For myself, there is no anger, nor conversely any condemnation of those who believe in a god either.
To my way of thinking we as freely thinking humans just hold a different view from one another.
We should all seek to be the best person we can be as that in itself is its own greatest reward :>)
@mrkim56 What you wrote is contrary to the Bible as you can never be good enought to enter Heaven.
Only Yahweh is good.
@AnhedoniaNightmare I see you still fail to understand my position, which I find preposterous at this point dude.
If I reject "your" god, and indeed all concepts of god, what on earth could possibly lead you to believe I would then somehow accept the religious construct of a heaven? And ... given that idea, why then would I care to go to some place I fail to believe exists?
In my thoughts, heaven on some other plane is a non-sequiter. We live our lives and create the world around us though our actions, which can be good or bad ... and that's all there is. Once we're gone, we're gone, plain and simple.
I will hafta relate there was one time in my life when I did envy believers for their faith, which was when my Mom passed away.
Everyone else was going on about how she was no longer in pain, was in a better place, was visiting with all her friends and relatives who'd preceded her, and indeed I envied them being able to believe those things.
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@mrkim56 Yes. You have no proof and thus what you have done is create a faith based belief system.
Tell me why your belief system is any more valid than mine. Defend your belief system.
You can't. In fact there is lots of evidence for Christianity and none for atheism.
Not only that, but what would be the basis for objective morality using atheism? There isn't any.
If Yahweh and the Trinity do not exist, why be good at all? If there are no consequences, just this life, then why be good? If you can steal and not get caught, then you should steal.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Yeah that's how the universe works, the exception however, is civilization. god didn't say "don't steal, kill, etc." Humans did
@KingDeathTrooper So you actively disbelieve in the TRINITY. You believe Christianity is just a human affectation?
@AnhedoniaNightmare The laws that you follow, that you believe are made by god, were made by man. A god wouldn't worry about such things, or set restrictions like that on mankind. We don't suppress our urges to lie, cheat, and steal based on god's word, we do it because the government tells us to so that we can live in a civilized world of general fairness.
@KingDeathTrooper Prove your assertion with logic and evidence. That is what would be required in any philosophy course. Sadly you failed.
We are not discussing god, but GOD ie Yahweh from the Bible. They are not the same as by definition, a god is a mythological being.
What you just did is called "begging the question". That is a fallacy in the dialectic. You jumped to the conclusion without proving the conclusion.
@AnhedoniaNightmare A christian calling out someone for not using evidence and logic? You understand the irony right? WE KNOW that the government put these laws in place, HOWEVER, if you make the claim that some god/creator "told us not to do these things" all you have to go on is some book.
I don't care what respective god you worship, nor do I care to argue semantics on how Yahweh is " totally " different from any other god. If the followers of a religion try to say that the world would have no consequence, if god weren't there to say "don't do that" I will step in to correct them.
The universe was created without laws in mind. There are no true laws, only the "laws" by which the universe is governed (Gravitation, Matter, and Light) and any god would know this, because that's how they are believed to have created it. We, as humans, put laws in place to protect weaker people so that they have a fair chance at life without being stolen from, raped, or murdered.
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@KingDeathTrooper Bold claims require extraordinary logic and evidence.
You provided neither.
Can you do what I do every hour without fail?
Your assertions are a faith based religion until you can do this.
@KingDeathTrooper The fact that a so-called random universe is actually NOT random but governed by myriad physical laws itself points to a Supreme Being!
ROFL
My gosh take some science courses.
@AnhedoniaNightmare If I am asked to believe in a "higher being" I usually agree, and tend to favor deism. That's the belief that if there is a "god", he created the universe and the laws (laws of the universe, not laws of guilt) by which it is governed, but doesn't care about your day to day life, or want to reward you with eternal paradise just for something as mundane as having been alive and "good". There is still a high probability it was just luck though.
@KingDeathTrooper Prove that by "luck" there is any chance whatsoever that the universe came to be.
That is illogical.
Only the worst degenerate gambler would take that bet!
How many lucky things ie random occurances would have to exist for DNA replication, transcription, and translation to occur?
That is NOT luck. That is intelligent design.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Prove that it is not luck, but intelligent design that made the universe come to be. HOWEVER there are a few rules for this challenge: you can't use any bull$hit scripture from any religion ( for example: my god is real because on page 232 of "our bible" it says so), OR make speculation about how it "isn't likely to have happened, because the odds weren't in our favour once, therefore they never were at any point"
Personally, I think it would have happened (and did happen) over the LOOOONG time existence has existed for. This wasn't a few-days-deadline type of thing, there have been billions of years each made up of moments. You are looking at it like this: there is only one moment in which existence has either a 25% chance to create the universe or a 75% chance it wont, and if it fails that probability check one time in one moment, there is and will be no universe ever. ...
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@KingDeathTrooper That is easy. You yourself could never come to be without intelligent design.
DNA is the proof as nothing about it is random. It is not only a programmed language but it is read and transcribed and translated by tiny biological machines.
Every cellular organelle is a tiny biological machine. Look at mitichondria. Look at how the lipid bilayer is formed to make membranes. Look at the sodium potassium pump. These are all biological machines.
m.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3BiZ97QFV...
m.youtube.com/watch?v=_bPFKDdWlC...
@AnhedoniaNightmare Yes, they are biological "micro machines"; and yes they are amazing. That still doesn't prove they were "intelligently designed" however; That's a severe leap in logic to make that assumption, just because the alternative seems unlikely.
They form, because the things that make them attract. It isn't intelligent design, or random chance that they are formed the way they are, it's just that they are attracted to each other by some fundamental law of the universe, and they form something useful, that attracts and connects to other things that make more useful things. This chain continues and gets bigger until finally forming into one cohesive individual. (an example of such beneficial groupings being: , , cells, tissue, organs, organ system)
@KingDeathTrooper When you see a car in the street, you think it spontaneously winked into existence?
ROFL
Why do you think scientists are agnostics and not atheists? It's obvious that intelligent design created elements like mitochondria, the Citric Acid Cycle. The more you study biochemistry and physiology, the more you reralize that intelligent design is the only plausible explanation.
m.youtube.com/watch?v=y-uuk4Pr2i...
Watch as kinesin protein literally "walks". That is NOT RANDOM.
Atheism consistently violates logic.
So right away, all atheists should at least be agnostic if they claim to be intelligent logical enlightened people.
Christians mere acknowledge this Supreme Being as Yahweh of the Trinity.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Of course it didn't wink into existence, the elements that make it were made when matter was being created though, (by energy moving VERY fast) but the car was manufactured (by humans) using the elements we have available to us on this planet.
Atheism may not have all the answers as of yet, we probably won't for a long time; but at least we seek them, people who have a religion are content to sit with the information they have and stay where they are, and are usually further from the truth than atheists.
@KingDeathTrooper See. What you did is made atheism a faith based religion as you have faith the answers will in time be forthcoming.
Explain how atheism is more logical??? It isn't which is why scietists are agnostic or Christian not atheist.
Go to a hospital. Talk to oncologists. They all know of miraculous recoveries that cannot be explained by science.
Especially talk to RNs. Many are Christian.
To be an atheist requires throwing logic out the window.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Miracles are just discoveries waiting to be made, and added to our overgrowing science. Time and time again miracles have become accepted practices of science after their true nature has been revealed, there haven't been any true cases however, of it "just being a miracle" and being chalked up to the work of "insert god here" That's not to say that every case has had an answer, but that an answer just hasn't been found, and may never be; that doesn't mean you can assume it's the work of "insert god here"
I think any answer could be revealed eventually if we looked into it enough, I don't think that with enough praying, faith, and goat sacrifices, some god will finally let me "access level two" and tell me every secret of the universe in my own special paradise.
As I said, we may not be entirely logical, or have all the answers, but we are more logical than religious people, that assume that because we lack the evidence at the time, we must be wrong and they must be right because of that alone.
@mrkim56 Define this. This is a glimmer of what is called subjective morality in philosophy and as such touches on ethics. Yet you halted before providing logic or evidence.
@laurie621 Agree. That is standard theology. If a disbeliever rails against Yahweh and the Trinity, then their actions demonstrate they exist.
Otherwise they are railing against nonexistent beings.
You don't see Crotchety railing against Sif of Scandanavia.
@laurie621 "We are not to argue our point of view for those that do not want to hear it it just makes it worse. It's a fine line and we should pray for wisdom."
You state this opinion. Where does it state in the Bible that your opinion is correct?
If that is true, explain Paul of Tarsus. He spread the Gospel throughout multiple lands and hostile people and won some over. He did not stop preaching because some didn't want him there.
The same is true of Jesus.
What you wrote is actually contrary to evangelism in the Bible.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Did he argue with them when they didn't agree or did he just keep preaching the word? He did not call names or take offense. As I said, imo, it's a fine line.
@laurie621 Really? Like Jesus calling them vipers and like white sepulcres(tombs)that appear clean but are full of dead men.
Read the Bible again. What you posted is not supported by Scripture.
@AnhedoniaNightmare He was speaking the truth, not arguing. There is a difference.. and the circumstance called for what was said at the time.
@laurie621 How can what he said be the truth if it is contrary to the Bible?
@AnhedoniaNightmare Be wise as serpents, and harmless as doves. That is biblical. It's also biblical to pray for wisdom.
@laurie621 Yes but that has no bearing on the conversation as one can do that and discuss sharing the Gospel.
The topic could have hundreds of more hits. Just because one person dislikes talking about Christianity is no reason to stop.
The rule of thumb is a balance against the Great Commission, and 1Peter 3:15, and Romans 14:12.
14 But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled; 15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:
16 Having a good conscience; that, whereas they speak evil of you, as of evildoers, they may be ashamed that falsely accuse your good conversation in Christ. 17 For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing.
1 Peter 3:14-17
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@AnhedoniaNightmare I know it's hard, just yesterday I thought a member here was making an insinuation and laughing at a post of mine..and I was rude to him. Firstly I was mistaken, he said he was totally agreeing with me...Secondly.. I should have kept my mouth shut or just ask him what he meant in private. Personally, I would not go about this the way you are. God is being judged by what we are seen and heard doing. Being saved does not give us a free pass.. we are held accountable more-so than non believers.
@laurie621 We cannot be held accountable unless we actually do something by sharing the Gospel.
Read it.
Matthew 5:14-15. What does it say? It's so VITAL that Jesus discusses it two MORE times in the Synoptic Gospels.
13 Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.
14 Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid. 15 Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house. 16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.
Matthew 5:13-16
This is in perfect agreement with the Parable of the Sheep and the Goats.
The Sheep and the Goats
31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
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@laurie621 that's why god allows satanists to keep springing up everywhere so they can go to war and expose the lies and corruption of the christian church. Love not hate is all that matters
@NinjaBoyOne Prove this with logic and evidence. What you wrote approaches word salad. Provide clarity.
top expert
Blessings laurie621, I agree with you completely. If we don't show the the love of God and try to live as Godly as we can then we can't be examples to others who need to know that God is always with them. You have indeed brought the right opinion. May God bless you and keep you always. 
@AnhedoniaNightmare Blessings Dear Brother AnhedoniaNightmare,
I believe you can find living a Godly life in:
Titus 2:12
It instructs us to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live sensible, upright, and godly lives in the present age,
@Aleciaandbobby Yes, I agree but while that is succint, it's just one verse.
569 views. I state this is direct evidence that the subject is of interest and is consistently of interest whenever a new topic is created.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Yes, I agree with you whole heatedly but, you did ask me where is that stated in the Bible? And I gave you what you asked me. 😊
@Aleciaandbobby Yes, you did. The whole point is to show the Biblcal basis of our beliefs. Thank you.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Thank you too for your input as well. It's refreshing to see people like yourself that have the ability to show and share the love to all in the name of Jesus. God bless you my dear brother AnhedoniaNightmare.
@Aleciaandbobby you're right except you don't need the word god in there just the word Love. God is just branding for a certain set of beliefs.
@NinjaBoyOne As the term "god" is "interchangeable" with love (universal love) it's beautiful. When it becomes a singularly manipulative and discriminating tool, it's off the menu. Thank you @BlackMagneto.
@ You made an assertion. The burden of proof is on you to supply logic and evidence.
@NinjaBoyOne Blessings BlackMagneto,
Yes, I am afraid you do because without using the word God there is no love, for God is Love as stated below.
1 John 4:8
8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
@NinjaBoyOne You made an assertion. Prove it. You can't. The dialectic is rigorous. When an assertion is made, whoever makes the assertion is expected to prove it as the burden of proof is on the one who makes the assertion.
Supply logic and evidence.
You also are mixing definitions.
A god is a mythological being.
GOD is YHWH ie Yahweh from the Bible. They are not the same.
master
Page view counts largely reflect self interest as combatants reply and refresh freq to read rebuttals. Popular? Nah, just tops the recent list because you blow loud and hard like Trump and other tele-evangelicals. Apologies for interrupting this inane spaghetti monster diatribe, but any idea when the looting and pilfering begins after you're done sucking the village?
@(⌐■_■) Prove it. Supply logic and evidence. The burden of proof is on you.
You see, very high demands are placed in the dialectic, ones that I am consistently following while you just belly ache. I'm not impressed.
Also you made an appeal to ridicule. Were this being judged, you would immediately FAIL as what you wrote is a fallacy.
@AnhedoniaNightmare You suck is not a fallacy, it's fellatio. Though it appears to be universe's humor delivered via spell-check because I meant SACKING THE VILLAGE... but thankfully 'grammar angels' fixed it. 0.0
@(⌐■_■) This is a prime example of an appeal to ridicule as a fallacy in the dialectic.
You fail at decorum and collegiality and intentionally use conflict to deflect as you cannot justify your assertion.
Why is that? Why are you ignorant of such fundamental concepts? You have unjustified beliefs that you accept on faith alone.
I on the other hand am hourly challenged and can provide logic and evidence and prove my assertions.
Don't be a lightweight.
In historical atheism, the atheists applied to the same equal rigorous standards of the "burden of proof".
{in your lap)
@(⌐■_■) Being childish accomplishes nothing. It's self-imposed impotence and self-sabotage.
@(⌐■_■) so what, freedom of speech, I'm not religious one iota but who cares if someone wants to discuss it? Live and let live. Why so hateful? And what the hell does Trump have to do with any of it?
member
if you only believe one way is right and all others are wrong that is the path to hypocrisy my friends and Jesus did command you all to love people of all kinds regardless of their faith. also christianity statred out as a suicide cult of people who would attack caravans in an attempt to get themselves killed to ascend to heavan. they were called the Circumcellions and they were around in 4BCE that's awfuly close to around the time jesus was born.
member
All religions teach the same thing to love people of all other religions. but religion is used as a tool for getting followers to discriminate against others. the fact is that The christian religion will only be around until 2500 anyway. we're in the age of the pisces in 2500 it will be the age of aquarius. Jesus said "i will be with you until the end of the ages(time)"...the real point is people take religion too far and think that they are speaking for or god is acting through them. that they are extensions of god's. People need to try figuring out what's good humans before they start trying to figure out what's good for the gods in the world.
@NinjaBoyOne This is patently false. All religions do not do as you say.
Prove your assertions with logic and evidence. Why don't you understand basic philosophy? It is as though you never took the time to learn yet you simultaneously want to discuss ontology and theology.
That is peculiar.
member
here's another good book. "Jesus and Buddah: the parallel sayings". also "Is the Father of Jesus the God of Muhammad?" is a good one. and here's another good movie in case you haven't seen it for all the white christian terror enthusiasts out there the movie "Agora -2009" about how the christians destroyed the library of alexandria and about 10,000 years of human history from before what we know today. (much like the muslim extremists are doing to mesopotamian artifacts now). religion drives people crazy and leads to people denying the real truths that are discovered every day.
@NinjaBoyOne What it the world is this ahistorical nonsense???
Bold claims require overwhelming evidence.
member
Bless Everyone that is alive not just the one's who don't disagree with you because after all we're all human (except for the aliens/shapeshifters/mutants/and robots)and good or evil muslim or white terrorist we are all flawed. the real truth is all around you not in a dusty 2000 year old book (actually there is a lot of real truths and history in the bible that just gets misrepresented/misenterptreted same as all other religions pity christians think that only their beliefs are right. if christians would work more with other religions instead of trying to assimilate everyone maybe we could actually start solving some of these mysteries in the world and make this a better place). Education not Assimilation. you take the high road and i'll take the low road. BLACK MAGNETO HAS SPOKEN!
@NinjaBoyOne What in the world does this mean? It's so random and unclear and requires lots of logical proof and evidence.
member
god loves satan he gave him the most important job next to being god. being anti-god.
@AnhedoniaNightmare He "made" him the best, next to himself. He "gave" him special privileges and natural gifts.
@KingDeathTrooper Yahweh is the name of the GOD from the Bible. That name is so sacred to devout Jews that they will substitute "Ha Shem or Adonai" instead of saying the name.
In history, one rabbi who was pure of heart would enter the Holy of Holies in the Temple in Jerusalem on the Day of Atonement and speak the Shemhameforesh which is the whole Name of Yahweh. That has not been spoken since the sacking of the Temple.
Yahweh gives us all free will. Even though YAHWEH is omnipotent, YAHWEH will not compel belief.
The Ha Satan is a title given to the being who also has the title Lucifer. His real name is hidden in Isaiah and if you study the Hebrew,then his actual name is Helel ben Shahar.
Helel ben Shahar abused his power and was cast to Gehenna along with a third of the heavenly host (angels who rebelled against the Trinity).
guru
"If god did not exist, man would need to create him" - an interesting idea with different meanings dependent upon who's interpreting it.
Some say, and I'd agree, that all gods are indeed constructs of man. "God" is used as a catch all for anything man can not (as yet) simply prove through common knowledge, science or reasoning. Instead, religion says total understanding is not required, that one just has to have faith in a god, who is omniscient and omnipotent.
The concept of a god and the ensuing promise of an afterlife naturally arises out of mans own sense of vanity. Man has always wanted to believe that their lives have more purpose than the life they live and experience, so through our own sense of vanity gods have been created who then promise a better life after we pass through the one we experience while alive on earth, with a caveat that if we live a godly life, our life will be extended for eternity on another plane of existence.
Most, though not all, concepts of a god teach us to love and care for one another as we would or should ourselves, regardless of one anothers beliefs. While this is solid logic, it hardly requires any constructed god to be logical or righteous.
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@mrkim56 Those that do not believe in God believe man came from nothing or a big bang caused by gasses that cannot come from nothing. That's the rub. Those that think Christians believe in a fairy tale because we believe by faith believe by faith themselves. No matter what you believe, you have to believe it by faith..
@laurie621 Let me put forth another possibility as none of your assertions apply personally.
The concept of a god, any god, the big bang or the concept of creation from nothingness are all improvable hypothesese, and as such are only theories. As such I do not assign total plausibility to any of them.
My position is that the mystery of creation has yet to have found an undeniably logical and provable answer. This simply means the real answer is still out there, just as yet undiscovered.
This assertions only required faith is that in time man will discover the answer.
@mrkim56 I understand that... but you believe it by faith. In other words, you have faith that it's a mystery. You believe we did in fact come from something or someone and you believe some day man will figure it out. That is not a scientific proven fact, so you believe it by faith. Having said that.... I cannot fathom why, believing the God of the Bible created us, would not be plausible to you.
@laurie621 What plausible answer is there for placing my belief in an implausible construct of a god based upon a book written by men and filled with a myriad of improvable miraculous claims?
Having always tried to be a logical minded person, putting faith in such an illogical and similarly improvable ideology makes no sense to me.
I don't deride others ideas of god, nor disrespect their worship or religious practices.
Quite simply I just choose to personally disagree to follow suit, nothing more or less than that.
There's one basic difference between myself and believers that sets us in diametrical opposition to one another philosophically.
Believers can not prove the existence of their god and must have faith in their construct of god to assign belief in it.
For myself I find no answer for any construct currently espoused as to our creation to be undeniably plausible, plain and simple, which requires no faith at all.
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@mrkim56 Well, there's nothing I can think to say. But I do wonder how you cannot be concerned at all for yourself considering you don't know for a fact what will happen to you when your body dies or when it will. I have always known in my heart he is there...always. And I did not learn it at home. It's just a knowing. I wish you well.
@laurie621 I'd say none of us knows with absolute certainty what happens when we die.
I'm grateful your faith gives you comfort and wish you well aussi :>)
@laurie621 I'm good not living in perpetual fear of an omnipotent-invisi-daddy that acts out like an alcoholic parent. I am however 100% certain that my eternal life is a matter of science as we are all star dust, and no one has a special warranty or service agreement with God nor Sears just because you can recite their publications.
@(⌐■_■) This is why philosohers most frequently use atheist examples like yours when discussing appeals to ridicule fallacies.
@laurie621 Blessings Laurie621, The problem with people who think like @mrkim56 think like most of the Scientist of this world. If they can't see it, taste it, feel it or some other wild concept it doesn't exist. They just can't understand faith.
The one deciple Thomas was right there and until Jesus showed him his scares he couldn't believe. That's why he got the name "Doubting Thomas." He was given this label because he simply did not believe that Jesus had risen from the dead. I too have been a 'Doubting Thomas.' But the experience made me a better person and made my faith so much more stronger.
Jesus appears to some of the disciples, but Thomas was not with them the first time.
John 20:25 says, "So the other disciples told him, 'We have seen the Lord!' But he [Thomas] said to them, 'Unless I see the nail marks in his hands and put my finger where the nails were, and put my hand into his side, I will not believe it.'"
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@Aleciaandbobby New Living Translation:Romans 1:20
For ever since the world was created, people have seen the earth and sky. Through everything God made, they can clearly see his invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature. So they have no excuse for not knowing God.-
To see and smell all of nature is more than enough evidence. It is not an accident that man and all creation was made perfect. Even though I have doubted at times..I shake it off and remind myself of every miracle he has done for myself and family members. It's incredible and not accidents or flukes. Just the other day..now this is minor in comparison to many, but my husband broke down coming home from town. We live pretty far out in the country and his pickup has become an old beater over the years.. He was in an explosion and lay for 30 days, them telling me he was a dead man but he lived and worked for 20yrs until his body just couldn't take it anymore. ...
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@laurie621 Blessings My Dear Sister laurie621, I agree with you 100%! I and my family have had our share of what you are talking about. Jesus is and always be in our house. We will never stop serving him humbly. In 1996 He called us to The Rose Of Sharon Prayer Ministry and that Ministry has millions of Prayer Warriors from all over the world. Please feel free to visit if you're ever in need of Prayer.
www.facebook.com/sistersoftheros...
@mrkim56 You made a lot of bold claims but supplied no logic or eVidence to support these claims. Now what is amusing is what you wrote is a fauth based system. You turned atheism into a religion! Yet you just go through saying that you wanted to end religion!
@AnhedoniaNightmare I'd say someone needs to brush up on those reading comprehension skillz dude.
I've quite clearly made the case that my thoughts are not based on faith at all.
It's only folks like yourself that keep trying to twist what's been said to substantiate your interpretation of what's been said.
Sorry if you can't neatly fit my position within what you deem as the way everyone else has to think, but please understand you'll never be capable of doin so for myself.
My thoughts and convictions are nothing but my own. I don't ever try to speak for others, that's their job and could never be mine :>)
@mrkim56 Wrong and it gives me no pleasure to correct you.
If one has beliefs without logic and evidence, then one who adheres to those beliefs is using "faith" to justify their belief.
That in a nutshell is why many scientists are not atheists but agnostic. Secondly as scientists know so very little and old paradigms fall to the wayside, and since knowledge of the universe is limited by our tools and ability to leave the Earth in search of answers.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Yep, that's another one that gets under my skin.
In many discussions like this I add that though I espouse atheism as my personal position as a rationally minded person I also have to admit that at some point I could be proven wrong in that assertion and instantly I always hear "No, you're NOT an atheist then, that means you're agnostic!"
Nope, I'm not some namby pamby fence stradler too damned indecisive to make up my mind on the issue, I'm just trying to be logical and accept all possibilities, like any truly reasonable person should do.
@mrkim56 Atheism is illogical.
Nothing cannot give rise to all the mass of thousands or even millions of galaxies.
Nothing cannot give rise to something due to the philosophical issue of infinite regression.
DNA is a programmed language that has order. It implies a Supreme Being. It's impossible for DNA and the complex aspects of it to be random. That is why the former atheist head of the Human Genome project accepted Christianity. He is brilliant and likely a genius. Are you wiser than him?
Just using probability theory, there has been insufficient time over billions of years for simple proteins to have evolved. As such, there is no possibility for intelligent life to have evolved.
I can go on and on. Atheism is extremely illogical. And not only that, what would be the basis for objective morality?
Everything we know from Chaos theory deminstrates that "randomness" does NOT exist. Fractals prove this. The Golden Mean proves this. Order is found everywhere in Nature. That points to a Supreme Being.
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@AnhedoniaNightmare Here's my last on this.
You get to believe how ever and what ever you so choose, that's your right.
Mine is to choose otherwise and all I ask is that you respect that choice just as I do yours.
All my best to you my adversarial friend :>)
@mrkim56 Yes because the TRINITY granted you free will.
ROFL
But an enlightened intellectual then justifies their beliefs with logic and evidence. You won't do this. Why?
I can justify my beliefs every hour of every day for more than 55 years. I am older but that was prior to being educated.
This is the classic problem of atheism. There is no logical way to justify it as it defies basic science and philosophy.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Ok, one last shot that should finally lay this all to rest, so here goes.
Let us suppose for the sake of argument that man was indeed designed and produced by god, any god, take your pick.
So now we have man having been made my your theory (please take note of this operative term THEORY) of intelligent design, Ok?
Now then, if we agree on the theory that man had to been manufactured by an omniscient god, because your logic dictates we accept that theory as a plausible construct, the final question left to be answered is, wait for it ...
Who then created god?
If your response is the pat "God always was and always will be." we'll just call it a day.
If you can't justify your position any more deeply than that, we're done.
Balls in your court, swing batter, batter, swing!
@mrkim56 That theory was accepted by both Charles Darwin and Issac Newton. I subscribe to it as well. So did the proponderance of scientists in history.
It's more valid due to Occam's Razor.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam�...
How can you measure time without the orbits of stars and the decay of isotopes?
@mrkim56 I did answer the question and in multiple ways.
Using Occam's Razor, Christianity and the Supreme Being of Yahweh was the prefered and prevailing theory since ancient times through the 19th century.
Time does not exist without the orbits of stars and without the isotopes of chemical elements. These are the basis for measuring time even Atomic clocks.
Anything prior is eternal by definition.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Strike 2! One last chance or you're outta the batters box for good. Quit talkin in circles and answer the question.
Who made god?
@mrkim56 god is a mythological being by definition.
GOD ie Yahweh is the Lord and Author of Creation. Any being who exists before time cannot be adequately understood as that BEING is essentially eternal as there are no stars or isotopes.
Why can't you understand basic physics?
@AnhedoniaNightmare Strike 3! Yer outta there!
I specifically told you the always was and always will be was not an acceptable answer. That's just a conundrum of circuitous logic, no matter how you couch it or by what reference you utilize in an attempt to support it.
However, I see we did arrive at agreement with the 1st sentence of your last response "god is a mythological being by definition".
Thanks for your honesty.
@mrkim56 See is the why scientists are agnostic not atheists.
Atheism is extremely illogical.
I gave you succint logical answers which you ignored. These were philosophically correct and scientifically sound.
You just don't like them.
Then you have fallacious thinking as you begged the question by the absurd illogical association that god=YHWH.
First you have to prove that assertion. You did not.
Second, you don't understand time and eternal from a physics and philosophcal standpoint.
Then your third strike is saying you have any authority to judge my answer when clearly you lack the intellectual rigor.
@AnhedoniaNightmare You offered nothing beyond the same circular firing squad answers every other theologian always uses, but at least you gave it your best shot.
The only true answer is you have no answer.
What's illogical is to continue to dance around the question and then pretend to have answered it.
Sorry, no credit for even a base hit. Take your out and hit the dug out.
I told you at the outset if you could offer no better answer than what you eventually gave, this conversation would be ended and now that's the result.
Again, thanks for your attempt, but we're done.
All my best, g'nite Gracey.
@mrkim56 This is the audacious retort of weak atheism. Honestly I'm shocked at the amateur quality of it. Clearly you are intelligent yet you consistently fail to understand basic philosophy and science.
Why is that?
Why is it you cannot justify your own beliefs?
Why can you not defend your own beliefs while hourly testing mine?
I have bent over backwards to answer trolls for a month. Why can't all the trolls do the same?
senior guru
@⭐️janerosity⭐️ Thanks for that one! It's already neatly tucked away in my techno music vids collection :>P
@⭐️janerosity⭐️ Blessings ⭐️janerosity⭐️, I enjoyed the vide being deaf from a young age till a young teenager I understood it. Thank you for sharing. God bless you!
master
m.youtube.com/watch?v=2BwWavExcF...
This is DNA transcription and translation. It is designed not random. A Supreme Being designed it.
master
Have you noticed that nonbelievers CONSISTENTLY fail to explain the veracity of their own belief systems? The reason is simple. Their belief systems are faith based and they have not taken the time to carefully contemplate why they believe them. And so they have not developed the philosophical logic and evidence nor found scientific evidence to justify their beliefs.
It's intellectual cowardice.
I can do this for 16 hours every day because I have spent 55 years of my life contending with the Scriptures by rigorous intellectual tests.
Why haven't you?
You accept something like atheism on blind faith. Why?
The burden of proof is on ANYONE who states a belief. That is the basis of the dialectic in philosophy. All have an equal burden of proof the second they admit to beliefs.
Claim your beliefs but justify them. If you cannot, you are no different than a rabid blind street prophet.
master
Let's say you visit a planet and find a machine. It did not randomly assemble. It was designed, materials were mined,parts were fabricated, assembled, tested, troubleshooted, and it operates.
That is what DNA transcription and translation is. It is not random but a machine. Therefore it was created by a Master Designer. Another name in Hebrew is Yahweh.
master
Atheists and antitheists consistently fail to comprehend that humans were/are spiritually driven creatures. Any ethnic group in history had spirituality...as if our brains were wired for it. To be human is to be spiritual.
This is why there are so many hits to any spiritual topic. The more atheists and antitheists deny the TRINITY, the more ardently and artfully the Christians will explain it while poking holes in atheism.
If they were smart, they would ignore it as they have silly easily dismissed retorts as they get angry when atheism is exposed as ignorance and childish magical thinking.
master
Imagine the stupidity of someone saying, "I'm not going to the website. My gosh it's for atheists!" How inane and weak can you get? Well that is what Crotchety is doing.
ROFL
master
ROFL
"Wahh Wahhh", says Crotchety. Those evil Christians have an agenda. Who cares that they have authoritative philosophy texts that disprove my inane ramblings? The Christians can't be right!
master
Poor Crotchety. He's good for a laugh even if it's laughing at a befuddled fool.
It's word salad. His posts are indicative of never stepping foot in a philosophy class let alone passing it with an A.
master
senior master
My lover's got humor
She's the giggle at a funeral
Knows everybody's disapproval
I should've worshiped her sooner
If the Heavens ever did speak
She is the last true mouthpiece
Every Sunday's getting more bleak
A fresh poison each week
"We were born sick", you heard them say it
My church offers no absolutes
She tells me 'worship in the bedroom'
The only heaven I'll be sent to
Is when I'm alone with you
I was born sick, but I love it
Command me to be well
Amen, Amen, Amen
Take me to church
I'll worship like a dog at the shrine of your lies
I'll tell you my sins and you can sharpen your knife
Offer me that deathless death
Good God, let me give you my life
Take me to church
I'll worship like a dog at the shrine of your lies
I'll tell you my sins and you can sharpen your knife
Offer me that deathless death
Good God, let me give you my life
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@DemandingFemale I seldom go into analysis of music but the lyrics and vid certainly seem miles apart in what's being said versus what's being shown.
@mrkim56 It's talking about the disapproval of whom some choose to love, that doesn't fit with the beliefs of the church.
"Every Sunday's getting more bleak
A fresh poison each week"
Sunday service poisoning the mind.
"I'll worship like a dog at the shrine of your lies
I'll tell you my sins and you can sharpen your knife"
I'll worship like a faithful puppy and confess my sins so I can then be punished, shunned or worse, in the case of the video, for the sins that I confess.
@DemandingFemale I see what you're saying. What's confusing I guess is the lyrics say she while the vid is obviously a gay male couple. Of course the same analogy applies.
@mrkim56 I think he started writing it after a breakup with a girlfriend and it morphed into something else. It's primarily a love song, but with anti-church undertones, performed like a gospel. It's a clever piece of writing that's for sure.
@DemandingFemale I liked the song the 1st time I heard it on the radio. Maybe it subconsciously appealed to my somewhat less than religious sensibilities without even knowing it :>)
@mrkim56 As all art, I guess it depends what it means to the individual listening to the song ot reading the lyrics. The video is a total different take on the lyrics written by Hozier during break-up with his girlfriend so that says a lot there. The director of the video created his own vision with it. However, it's basically a love song full of metaphors written by an Irish artist who is not "gay". It's definitely something that will cause people think. ;)
It's also not "Anti" anything...
When I first heard this song before ever watching this video, I had a completely different visual in my mind. What it meant to ME was nothing in the video and why I posted both.
Such a beautiful piece that can be dissected then interpreted in so many ways. Thought provoking for sure!
@3UN01A Hozier has spoken about the song several times.
Here is a quick interview he did where he talks about the connection with the Catholic church.
@DemandingFemale I've seen this before...
There's many interviews and info about the lyrics of this song as well as the video. I am sure you will come across it the more you Google/Research. Thanks for sharing and do feel free to post more here when you come across it.
@3UN01A As one who writes for pleasure myself I've always been leery about interpreting other artists words. While in truth that is what all written art is meant for as the interpretation lies within the reader, regardless of what the author may have had in mind when they penned it.
In school when we were asked to interpret literature I always despised the idea there was a right or wrong answer in doing so.
I felt that unless the teacher had held a conversation w/the author, then their individual interpretation was no more correct than any other a student might give.
Tried to find it on youtube but couldn't so here's some lyrics from a song I feel conveys these ideas well. By the Stereo MCs- "Sketch"
I wanna know why we ain't conversin'
I wanna know why we always reversin'
Fobbin' me off with a web of diversion
Check the artist sketch if you want the true version
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@mrkim56 I write a little, but sing a lot. Personally, I would never sing a song without having some idea on what the song is about.
Yes, art is interrupted by the viewer/listener, but that is also part of the reason why songs like 'Every Breath You Take' and Al Green's 'Let’s Stay Together' make it to the top of first dance songs lists at weddings.
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@DemandingFemale I hear you hon, the lyrics are always important, as well as the subject matter itself, the music and for some time now with videos, the visual appeal.
All the above is rolled together to present an overall feel of what's really goin on, up front as well as in the back story.
As a bona fide music FREAK lol it's a topic I can go on and on about though this problee iddn the best thread for such a discusssion.
However here's a smattering of some stuff from the same era as when the Stereo MCs were on that charts that always light me up [SPOILER] ...
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@DemandingFemale Well that is straight from the horse's mouth. The video is a criticism of the treatment of homosexuality in Russia and being tarred with the same brush as beastiality and paedophilia.
The song is a criticism of the Catholic Church and their control over sexuality.
Crystal Clear. From the writer and singer of the song Hozier.
Nice one Hozier.
Nothing to do with going to mass on Sunday mornings.
guru
If a man wants to know if God exists, he will look and seek him out with an open heart...If he wants to believe he's not, he will look for ways to support his beliefs and reject sound judgment.
The proof is all around us and cannot logically be refuted.. it's a choice and it's the most important decision you will ever make. When the body dies, that choice is gone for ever. God made it simple and uncomplicated for us to understand.
@laurie621 I have sought god at numerous points in my life yet have as yet to have found any proof of him.
Of course the world's a wonderful place with much to be appreciative of but that in of itself still offers no proof of gods existence either.
Having pondered the idea of dying an atheist, having rejected gods existence I find it curious that an all loving god could embue me with the intellect to reject him sans positive proof of his existence, then damn me to eternity for having used it? If that's a loving god thank goodness he's not a vindictive one!
@mrkim56 I don't know what on earth you are looking for that out-proves the system we live in. It's completely obvious. Because of that, I would think a man would have to work harder at not believing than believing in God. Mark 10:25
It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.-
Maybe he meant richly schooled as well.. I don't know.
@laurie621 I've looked for him to reach back when I reached out openly to him. Nothing happened.
Please understand that using scripture to try and make a point to an atheist is futile.
If I don't believe in god, what makes you think I'd believe the words in the bible?
A similar example might be in trying to utilize pages from The Cat In The Hat to explain Of Mice And Men.
Richly schooled? I have a High School diploma and 3 semesters of Real Estate courses I took in Jr College.
@laurie621 Excellent, then we're on the same page as I'm not trying to sway anyone to my view either.
I just try to make people think for themselves and explore alternative views or perceptions of reality.
Those who just accept what's been spoon fed to them throughout their lives without truly and deeply inspecting the basis behind those ideologies owe it to themselves to do so.
I get it though, getting people to actually THINK is tough ... ask me how I know LOL
@laurie621 I am not the kind of person to stoop to name calling. I see that as base, unintelligent and uncalled for. As one who enjoys debate I similarly despise argumentativeness and view them as miles apart from one another.
I appreciate the time and space we've shared here and thank you for your kind thoughts :>)
@laurie621 Oh yes, I understood that and thank you for your concern.
Glad you gotta kick outta harkening back to George Burns and Gracie :>)
top expert
Just here for the comedy and popcorn. Thank Jewsus I'm an Apatheist.
The funniest bit is, the one trick pony show doesn't fail to amuse me with complete irrelevance.
Carry on.
@PsychoDeeDee The position of ignorance is the worst possible position to be in concerning the dialectic. It means you lack the ability to learn.
Obviously you do care.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Incorrect. I neither require or concern myself with any proof or evidence, you wouldn't be able to provide anyway. In that context, it's a complete waste of energy. That's not ignorance, it's efficiency.
All this needless gibberish about "god" and whatnot seems to take up a lot of your time so, I'm going to let you get back to that but, here's the take-away, I don't agree with you. Nor am I under any obligation to.
That is a common misconception many of your ilk have. Oh no, he'll just go to hell then. I might have done A LOT of crappy things in the past but, the reality is, nothing could be farther from the truth.
@PsychoDeeDee So you are a liar because you claimed to be an apathist. Why should anyone believe a liar?
@AnhedoniaNightmare There's no lie there bud. Apparently you've failed to grasp that as well.
@PsychoDeeDee The position of ignorance cannot be true based on your answers.
The position of not caring cannot be true based on your answers.
Buddy, you care and know you care. That's why you are here.
@AnhedoniaNightmare You're confusing apathy for ignorance. Even if 1 of any of the wild claims Christians have made pan out, [SPOILER] I'd still be indifferent. Why? Because it wouldn't effect me either way. I have no reason to care.
What I do care about is, brain-washed parrots like you trying to spread untruths to innocent people. I feel that it's an affront to civilization in general.
I'm not in that other guy's fan club by any means but, he asked for some type of proof. We both know you can't provide that so, as irrelevant as that is, I was amused by how you Confidence manned your way over it. And, then have the balls to call me a liar. lol. It's that attitude that discredits anything you've tried to do here.
No interest in pooping on your fantasy dude. I don't know you or want to, I just feel like you're pushing your agenda too far. ...
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@PsychoDeeDee You are a liar. Not only do you care, you want to prevent me from talking and want others to end up in Gehenna.
I share my testimony to save people from Gehenna.
Troll/reprobates want others to go to Gehenna.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Then I want to go where the retrobates are so can you give me the effing itinerary, costs, vacination shots and the weight alowance?
We can talk about the saving on the plane.
As a 100% troll, I expect you will be joining us then, Aisle seat or window?
At the window, you'll be closer to heaven.
master
Do you understand as a nonbeliever why Christians share their testimony? What's the rationale? What do we get out of it?
Christians are already saved, so sharing the Gospel is not a qualifier to be a Christian and have salvation.
We don't share the Gospel to feel good. Trolls love to say spiteful things to us. Horrible things while we are discussing Jesus.
We need no justification. The reward is complete.
We share testimony to help YOU...the nonbeliever because at a certain point, a nonbeliever becomes so rigid they refuse all attempts and at that point, they become a reprobate.
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; 19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. 20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: 21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
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master
Yahweh wants you to be saved. Jesus says the same,"I will draw all men to me..."
But when a troll becomes a reprobate, the TRINITY realize that troll cannot be saved. Due to free will, the TRINITY stop trying.
You think Christians are trying to convince trolls when we know trolls who are reprobates are already unsavable.
Christians are trying to save the silent observers, not the reprobates, because the silent nonbelievers who observe...might still be saved.
Imagine a battlefield. A medic bravely goes on the battlefield. And the wounded are many and suffering. The medic can't save all. Some are too badly wounded, so the medic triages who can still be saved.
If a medic comes across combative wounded, then those folks cannot be saved and focusing on them may cause others to lose their lives.
master
6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
John 14:6
There is no other way to Heaven except through Jesus Christ.
The soul is eternal. You either choose Jesus and go to Heaven or you choose to go to Gehenna.
senior guru
master
It is easy to meet the TRINITY, but you have to be 100% sincere.
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. 21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
John 3:16-21
You know you commit sins(errors). To meet the TRINITY, you have to come into the light ie the presence of YAHWEH and then confess your sins...sincerely. ...
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senior master
Just a little bit of clarification regarding the word RETROBATE which is being bandied around here as a synomym for a troll and vice versa. The word RETROBATE has been around as long as formal science, and has nothing to the original definition of TROLLING which meant searching/fishing.
From the M-W dictionary we find ...
reprobate noun
Definition of reprobate: an unprincipled or depraved person : SCOUNDREL, ROGUE
Cemeteries were seldom placed on the north side of a church, which, if used for burial at all, was reserved for unbaptized children, criminals, reprobates and suicides.
— Rosemary Ellen Guiley
Modern meaning for Trolling according to M-W gives with examples;
2a : to antagonize (others) online by deliberately posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments or other disruptive content
… trolls engage in the most outrageous and offensive behaviors possible—all the better to troll you with.
— Whitney Phillips
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@..box.. He's a serial downvoter. Doesn't matter what the topic is, he'll downvote just because he's a rebel! lol 
@DemandingFemale I noticed that too. Members go to all the trouble of writing a comment only to get downvoted willy nilly without even being read. Shame.
@..box.. He's gonna end up with carpal tunnel from all the repetitive clicking at this rate.
@DemandingFemale He's not going to tell me how to get to Gehenna on the cheap. Maybe I should ask him about tickets for Liverpool and Spurs? Might have more luck.
master
m.youtube.com/watch?v=E3nvMkj0BG...
Anyone who has not committed the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit (an unforgiveable sin according to Jesus) can be saved.
It takes less than five minutes if you are sincere.
There is no reason for any soul to be in Gehenna. It is easy to be saved.
Right this second, people reading this, without pomp and a church, could be saved in their own homes.
You do NOT have to be good to be saved. You do not have to be perfect or sinless to be saved.
senior master
Now can you explain in layman's terms if I can get a direct flight with Ryanair to this place you call Gehenna or is there a stopover in Frankfurt?
Is it in the northern hemisphere (North America, Europe and bits of other places) or in the southern hemisphere (lots of South America, lots of Africa, Australia, New Zealand and bits of very important places in Asia too)?
Will the saving instructions be given before taking off, in the usual way?
Much obliged.
master
m.youtube.com/watch?v=Hog3zNz93s...
The great secret of the Bible is that YHWH (Yahweh) means "Behold the hand, behold the nail".
From the beginning of Time, the TRINITY knew that one day Jesus would die by crucifixion to save all humanity as a perfect sacrifice and ransom for all sin for the whole world.
senior master
Asked 3 straightforward simple questions and always the same - never a direct answer. You sure you didn't work in the world of politics or law?
master
Think about it. I'm trying to give you a way for your eternal soul to forever be at peace and live on in contentment.
I'm describing a way of altruism that helps all who are suffering. Christianity is a spiritual system that places helping the suffering and loving all just slightly less important than loving the TRINITY.
You lose nothing by adhering to it. In fact, the world could be a utopia by believing in Christianity.
How many hours have I spent communicating this? My actions are not selfish.
Meanwhile troll reprobates want you to fail and not help the suffering and not trust in the TRINITY and for your soul to end up in Gehenna.
What would motivate them to do this? Are they minions of Lucifer? It seems so.
@AnhedoniaNightmare "I'm trying to give you a way for your eternal soul to forever be at peace and live on in contentment."
That should be spelled: "an aggrandized self serving prophet who's imagined assistance is simply bombastic biblical regurgitations, that are as welcomed as a rat turd in cereal."
senior master
I love the MINIONS - like the crazy gang only cuter.
As I have said in the past, I could never be in a club where they accept your membership. Black balling should be considered in this Happy House and that fact that you are already saved and won't even give out the basic travel arrangements makes me think that maybe you are NOT SAVED at all and you are still waiting for your calling card.
Saved people don't work so hard putting people off organised religion and belittling those with a different view point.
And it is clearly UNChristian to make certain accusations and insults against members here on this thread like ...
"Liar", "He's good for a laugh even if it's laughing at a befuddled fool.", "Your answers were so dumb that it's clear you are just a waste of time."
These are not the words of Jesus NOR of the Christian way.
Is this type of exchange necessary in a public forum AHN? Is it necessary to advertise a movie site using threads in this way and mocking others who put forward their own personal beliefs.
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master
Read the Bible.
Jesus is far more harsh.
13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves , neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.
14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.
15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.
16 Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor! 17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold? 18 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty. 19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift? 20 Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon. 21 And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein. 22 And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon.
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@AnhedoniaNightmare Sit and spinneth on an Iron Throne that ye may sink a hefty splinter. 
~ House of Lanister & GOT
@AnhedoniaNightmare Can we get something straight here?
Throwing blank verses in my face and claiming that they are the words of a carpenter when we know that the gospels were written long after the events of this period and thus are open to debate as to the veracity of the statements stated as no recording devices were used and as you have shown, memory is do fickle - does not encourage me to go down the rabbit hole with you into wonderland.
I cannot find anything that is of relevance to me or to people of the 21st century in this text as it was written for a different mentality. Society has advanced and language has become clearer in the mouths of true teachers who can explain without making it into a d**k measuring contest as to how long is each other's resume and how many hours of class/church/medical studies did you attend before you can talk to me. It is all about you - Your are not saving, you are not educating - you are an embarrassment to the Christian ways and teachings. You wallow in the texts of the past that has no relevance to the people of the present.
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senior master
O wearisome condition of humanity!
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot and yet forbidden vanity;
Created sick, commanded to be sound.
What meaneth nature by these diverse laws?
Passion and reason, self-division cause.
Is it the mark or majesty of power
To make offenses that it may forgive?
Nature herself doth her own self deflower
To hate those errors she herself doth give.
For how should man think that he may not do,
If nature did not fail and punish, too?
Tyrant to others, to herself unjust,
Only commands things difficult and hard,
Forbids us all things which it knows is lust,
Makes easy pains, unpossible reward.
If nature did not take delight in blood,
She would have made more easy ways to good.
We that are bound by vows and by promotion,
With pomp of holy sacrifice and rites,
To teach belief in good and still devotion,
To preach of heaven’s wonders and delights;
Yet when each of us in his own heart looks
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(Chorus Sacerdotum by Fulke Greville) 
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@3UN01A You'll find God in your own heart.
God = You, the best version of yourself.
Whatever you do in your life, every action, decision, etc. in the end serves only one person/goal.
Yourself.
Lets all try to become the best version of oneself. Don't thank some dude in the sky for "giving you the strength" to achieve your goals, you've had that power within you all along.
But there's also no dude in the sky to blame for the sh*tty stuff. Shit happens, want something better or a different outcome?
You can make that change. No one else is going to do it for you.
Well, this is what I got from Fulke's poem :)
@LiliLawless This is probably what Jesus was getting at in all his teachings Lili.
Maybe the external deity with the three parts and his angels and his floods and earthquakes that some here wax lyrical about, maybe, just maybe is an internal issue.
As you said, Lili in plain English, "be the best version of yourself. "
What a wonderful way to think and the power to change is inside without the need to convert anyone. No need to insult, to belittle, to show disrespect.
I think you may have answered the question of the OP in so far as there is no need to annoy others - you are not commanded to intrude on others nor are you commanded to impose teachings on others.
Work on yourself and let the others work on themselves (if they wish).
Thank you for a comment that actually made me think.
master
The most thoroughly documented writings in history are the Bible as we have many magnitudes more primary sources.
If you choose eternal seperation from the TRINITY, you cannot blame the TRINITY.
I don't care if you believe or not. No one can enlighten you but yourself. You use free will and choose to believe. Belief is never compelled in Christianity as YHWH is the source of all love.
No matter what, Romans 1 tells us that reprobates are so far gone, they likely will never change and so are doomed.
When I make replies, the real people I am addressing are the silent observers...not the reprobates.
master
m.youtube.com/watch?v=W1_KEVaCya...
Be a good critical thinker. Watch as the odds are calculated that a very small chain of amino acids formed a protein by random chance.
It's so remote as to approach impossibility. Then how would it ever replicate?
There literally based on probability theory and permutations has been insufficient time in 4.6 billion years for a 150 amino acid protein to have formed even once. Once is impossible...let alone complex lifeforms.
Based on random chance alone, and furiously combining billions of attempts every second, the Earth should be a sterile rock devoid of life.
Atheism is nonsense and unscientific. You only think you are atheists when most nonbelievers are agnostic.
And then the more you study science, the more peculiar incidents just don't add up. Then you have to at least consider Christianity.
senior guru
I have a better question. Why do you all thing you have free will or freedom at all?
Even if you are a non-believer or a believer why do you think you got free will?
Why do people do anything? It's because they want to or they are forced to.
End of story. Write your predetermined comments and hate comments.
@xRimax The fact that you can ask the question shows you have free will.
The fact that I answered the question, shows I have free will.
Both of us could have refused to participate.
We are not just "brains in a vat" and living an illusionary life.
www.philosophy-index.com/putnam/b...
If there is no free will, there is no love.
If there is no free will, then none of us can be blamed for any violations of objective morality.
Please tell me you are not a nihilist.
@AnhedoniaNightmare You and I both commenting only proves that we want to comment. It's not because of free will.
Why are you preaching here? Because you want to. Want isn't free will.
You read- www.philosophynews.com/post/2012... for better understanding.
@xRimax This is why I raised the classic philosophical concept of a "brain in a vat".
I suspected you were a nihilist.
If there is no free will, then the pool deluded fools believing such, are self-imposed slaves.
They have no choices. They are no vegans or omnivores, heterosexuals or homosexuals, Christians or atheists.
They cannot love or hate. They cannot choose political parties.
Such impotent creatures are fools who shrug their shoulders, become biological robots, abrogate themseves of any wrong doing, all because they claim there is free will.
It's pathetic. To such a person, the rapist and the raped are both victims of a merciless malevolent evil deity.
It's imagining Lucifer as omnipotent and toying with not only 100 % of humanity, but 100% of all creatures in a cosmic chess game against himself.
How can anyone take you seriously?
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@AnhedoniaNightmare obviously you didn't read the article and didn't watch the video.
You can be anything. For that you will have to want it first. Then work for it. Do not suspect anything. Please read properly then answer properly.
@xRimax Nope.
You made a claim. Support that claim and quit pretending you have any clue about philosophy.
You created a MOUNTAIN of work for yourself as when you make claims, the burden of proof is on you to prove those claims.
@AnhedoniaNightmare I didn't make any claim. That is a fact. It breaks your world, doesn't it? If there is no free will, then there cannot be any God.
Learn to accept scientific facts.
You didn't come from someone in heaven. Eve or Adam. You evolved into human.
Learn to accept your wrong facts, earth ain't flat. Earth wasn't created before the sun.
Learn to accept the fact the very free will you are so proud of when you want to exercise it you go to hell.
@xRimax These are unsubstantiated claims until YOU prove them and in the dialectic, whoever makes the claims has the burden of proof.
ROFL
@xRimax Now you just are being puerile.
I exposed the facts that you have done nothing but make claims.
Try doing this in any philosophy course. You won't be laughing but laughed at by all.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Your God won't judge me.
You can laugh. You can smile you can pray.
Your God doesn't exist.
Period.
Your brain is filled with few gospels. That is all.
You are being laughed by a lot of people. People can laugh at me. Because obviously more than 4 billion people on earth believe that Jesus existed. 2.2 billion claims him to be a God.
But hey, no one thought we could go to Moon. We did. Again, do not confuse science with philosophy. Do not confuse personal belief with scientific Facts.
Again, preach what you practice. See what happens.
@AnhedoniaNightmare And watch this video before you become all libertarian. www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRYDaFeb...
Thanks.
master
Explain to me what "be the best version of yourself" actually means because it sounds incredibly dense and selfish like becoming a total narcissist.
By what criteria is this determined? What is the basis for objective morality here to determine ethics?
There is none.
An uber rich billionaire may think the best version of himself is taking all wealth.
A homicidal maniac may think the best version of himself is murdering perfectly and in as many numbers.
It's self absorbed nonsense while the people are starving and suffering.
newbie
"... till the very end of the age." which age? since we are now in the "information age" then surely the age Christ was talking about came to an end... ages ago? Guess that's why Christianity has been in the decline...
@Jolowilliamson What does Jesus say will mark the time?
3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
False Christs
5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many. 6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. 7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. 8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.
Witnessing to All Nations
(Mark 13:10-13; Luke 21:10-19)
9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. 10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. 11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. 12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. 13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
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@AnhedoniaNightmare so no answer but thanks for the sermon. i only read the old testament, if true then it is the infallible word of your god. anything that comes after is merely spun by the catholic church into lies. look at the wealth of the church then look at the starving children of your lord. then ask yourself. is your god a hateful, vengeful god, or a loving one? war, famine, hate never stopped and never will that is the true nature of man, remember the christian god is made in mans image, not the other way round. i did notice u only mentioned passages from the new testament, read the old, its much more interesting from an agnostic viewpoint. each to their own though. shalom.
master
I did answer. You let your own spiritual blindness keep you from reading and comprehending it.
The largest Christian persecution in postmodern history is occurring and Jesus says when that starts AND the Gospel has been preached in all the world, then the end will come.
The Gospel has been preached in every country.
The time is now.
When the Abomination od Desolation occurs, then that is when the Harpazo occurs.
Why do you think Christians began evanglizing in earnest after 1948?
I mean, we could just stay silent.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Help me to open my eyes.
How many disciples did Jesus appear to after his resurrection?
Twelve (I Corinthians 15:5)
Eleven (Matthew 27:3-5 and Acts 1:9-26, see also Matthew 28:16; Mark 16:14 footnote; Luke 24:9; Luke 24:3 3)
Where was Jesus three days after his baptism?
After his baptism, the spirit immediately drove him out into the wilderness. And he was in the wilderness forty days ... (Mark 1:12-13)
Next day after the baptism, Jesus selected two disciples. Second day: Jesus went to Galilee - two more disciples. Third day: Jesus was at a wedding feast in Cana in Galilee (see John 1:35; 1:43; 2:1-11)
Was baby Jesus life threatened in Jerusalem?
Yes, so Joseph fled with him to Egypt and stayed there until Herod died (Matthew 2:13 23)
No. The family fled nowhere. They calmly presented the child at the Jerusalem temple according to the Jewish customs and returned to Galilee (Luke 2:21-40)
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@xRimax I thumbed you up, not because you are correct, but because you have made assertions there are flaws in the Bible, multiple ones but without doing any exegesis or hermaneutics.
Why is that?
The burden of proof is on YOU, not me as you stated these issues. Thus you have about an entire month cut out to PROVE your assertions.
Have you actually taken any philosophy courses? It seems unlikely.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Those are all contradictions. Please read your book properly.
Your book is filled with it. I can post more 50,000 contradictions.
And I have read your book.
@xRimax Nope. YOU claim those are contradictions.
The burden of proof is on you to prove they are contradictions.
Good luck as these are very old claims that have been proven false in theology.
ROFL
@AnhedoniaNightmare You cannot answer them. Burden of proof? It's on you. You claim it to be the words of God. Not me. It's on you. Answer my questions. These aren't assertions, allegations or accusations.
@xRimax Of course you are asserting these are contradictions, thus the burden of proof is on you.
You are a district attorney making claims of guilt, which takes no intellectual prowess whatsoever, but then pathetically cannot prove that guilt.
Rather impotent, no?
@xRimax What hipocracy. You make a LITANY of unsubstantiated claims with zero logic and evidence.
You have no appeals to logic or ethics.
It's worse than a 12 year's feeble attempt. You merely are ranting yet then claim you have no free will, thus you are just a slave to an evil deity.
See Descartes.
senior guru
Let us remember one of your earliest post, AN.
A trained medical professional unable to take a dose of his own medicine.
@mrkim56 1852 hits.
And this is not the first time that Christianity inspires such high numbers on the topics.
It generally does.
Atheists want censorship because they cannot defend their faith-based religion.
Yet Christianity is not only more logical, but we Cristians can defend what we believe.
@AnhedoniaNightmare More logical?
Bible says in Genesis Ch. No. 1 Verses No. 3 and 5,…‘Light was created on the first day.’ Genesis, Ch., 1 Verses, 14 to 19… ‘The cause of light - stars and the sun, etc. was created on the fourth day’. How can the cause of light be created on the 4th day - later than the light which came into existence on the first day? - It is unscientific.
Further, the, Bible says Genesis, Ch. 1, Verses 9 to 13… ‘Earth was created on the 3rd day. How can you have a night and day without the earth ? The day depends upon the rotation of the Earth Without the earth created, how can you have a night and day?
Genesis, Ch. No. 1 Verses 9 to 13 says… ‘Earth was created on the third day.’ Genesis Ch. No. 1 Verses 14 to 19 says…‘The Sun and the Moon were created on the fourth day.’ Today science tells us… ‘Earth is part of the parent body… the sun.’ It cannot come into existence before the sun – It is unscientific.
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@xRimax The burden of proof is on you to prove what you state.
How ridiculous to make a litany of copy oasta from an atheist site.
Each assertion is now YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to prove.
@AnhedoniaNightmare I do not have to prove those. Those are already proven even before i was born. Every kids knows about them.
But not you.
You should try it out sometimes.
Maybe it will be better than unicorns and 4 legged insects. Who knows what else you will find out.
master
Yes. I did evangelism in real life for decades.
Yes, you cannot do evangelism online.
However, you can always give testimony. That is called witnessing.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Leviticus 11:20–22: All flying insects that walk on all fours are to be detestable to you. There are, however, some winged creatures that walk on all fours that you may eat: those that have jointed legs for hopping on the ground. Of these you may eat any kind of locust, katydid, cricket or grasshopper.
Matthew 4:8: Again the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor.
Psalms 104:5 He set the earth on its foundations; it can never be moved.
Clear the air, for i have sin.
@xRimax You are clueless.
In philosophy when you disbelieve, then having made assertions, it becomes YOUR responsibility to carefully prove your assertions.
Better get started as you keep doing this and the burden of proof is on you...not anyone else.
master
I don't know this God that others use. They could be talking about Lucifer as their God.
The only GOD I know is the TRINITY: YAHWEH, YESHUA, and RUACH
@xRimax The Trinity is revealed all throught the Bible.
From the very beginning the ELOHIM are PLURAL in Let US make Man in OUR image.
Genesis 1:26-28
YAHWEH, YESHUA, and RUACH are those so named. They are all throughout the Bible. They are theologically called the TRINITY.
@AnhedoniaNightmare How does an Omnipotent God require ppl like You to spew his Thoughts and Prayers - albeit words in a human novel - when that omnipotent being could zap peace, love and understanding into existence like "everything else god wants". OH yeah "Free Will" cuz God Loves a Good Fight? THEN GOD SURE LUV'S EWE DUDE.
@(⌐■_■) If free will existed Eve shouldn't be punished for eating a fruit. oh hey, God is love.
Samuel 15:3: "This is what the Lord Almighty says ... 'Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.' "
in Exodus 22:18: "Do not allow a sorceress to live."
Psalm 137, which celebrates this terrible revenge: "Happy is he who repays you for what you have done to us / He who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks."
Peter 2:18: "Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the cruel."
Pure love.
@xRimax The second you make assertions, the burden of proof is on YOU to prove them.
ROFL
@AnhedoniaNightmare Oh these are not assertions. These are verses from your book.
You shouldn't be laughing. Because you ain't answering any questions. You are just making comments.
@xRimax I'm laughing at YOU.
Clearly you don'tunderstand philosophy and the dialectic.
You made claims there were contradictions. Prove it.
These are old chestnuts long proven NOT to be contradictions and the subject of historic theology.
You are acting like suddenly these are proof when actually they are very old tired banal attempts that have long ago been disproven.
ROFL
@AnhedoniaNightmare I didn't make any claim. They are contradictions. Read your book.
You are now making a fool of yourself. You think you know the bible. You do not know it. Because you do not read it except few gospels. I have show my proofs. You prove me wrong now.
@xRimax NOPE.
That is not how philosophy works.
I suggest you open a book on it because you clearly don't understand.
All you have done is copy pasta claims of contradictions.
Anyone can make claims.
In philosophy, one making a claim offers proof using either logos, ethos, or pathos.
But worse, you made a claim free will does not exist, so FIRST, you have to prove that.
ROFL
@AnhedoniaNightmare I didn't claim. It is a fact. Accept it.
Do you know what a facet is?
Do you keep slave? Do you stone women to death? Do you beat your children with something? If not you ain't following your book. Period. Do you kill a non believer.
I do not think you have committed any of those crimes.
Therefore you are a hypocrite.Preaching about fairy tales and unicorns and other fantasy.
@AnhedoniaNightmare oh, read your book preacher. Or should i read it for you write down the verses? You are the in denial.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Deuteronomy 22:23-24
"If there is a girl who is a virgin engaged to a man, and another man finds her in the city and lies with her, then you shall bring them both out to the gate of that city and you shall stone them to death; the girl, because she did not cry out in the city, and the man, because he has violated his neighbor's wife. Thus you shall purge the evil from among you.
Read your book preacher. Not claiming they are there.
@xRimax Anyone can quote Scripture even Lucifer according to Jesus.
But most of the old law was done away with based upon the entire Book of Romans.
@xRimax You have run out of leeway as I am under no obligation as a Christian to bear witness to a reprobate.
You can't be bothered to defend your silly simplistic unsubstantiated claims, then seem obsessed that I disprove your so-called contradictions.
What's up with that? Not only is that is IMPOSSIBLE if there is no free will, but your actions are IMPOSSIBLE as you claim you are a slave.
@AnhedoniaNightmare You obviously have no knowledge about facts.
You defend your fairy tale. I hope the betting man was right, especially for you.
You know the betting man philosophy. Otherwise it will be nothing. Keep up your belief.
One day like me you will die and nothing will happen. Even something happens, i hope you don't burn. My best wishes to you.
I do not claim anything. I have stated facts. And i ain't slave of anyone or anything.
My choices are mine alone.
But you are a slave to the gospels. Be the slave defend it. I got 00 time for a hypocrite like you, who rarely answer but always thinks he is correct. In other word you are deluded.
Practice your book preacher. Then speak. I guess to the judge and jury not me.
"ROFL"
guru
It seems this thread has lost momentum and before it gets buried and never to see the light of day again.. I would like to say that I do care very much and hope I didn't sound as if I don't. We are all going to go somewhere for eternity after our bodies die or the second coming if we are still here, which imo is anytime now, so very close. He tells us in his word we are to know the season but only he knows exactly when. I cannot fathom that's it not at our door. So please, take the things of God serious.. When it's all said and done.. you want to be with Jesus. Take care all.
master
But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with.
1 Peter 3:15
It's every Christian's responsibility...not just mine.
@xRimax By your own admission, you are not a creature with free will, but a biological meat puppet.
As such, how could you prove anything? You literally have no choice if you have no free will!
ROFL
@AnhedoniaNightmare Not mine. Scientific. If you have a brain then you would understand. I guess you do not even have that. Laugh at yourself. Because you are liar.
@xRimax No. In fact the head of the Human Geonome Project became a Christian because Christianity was more scientific than antheism and agnosticism.
What amuses me is you believe you have no free will, then get angry and obsessed. That would take free will!
ROFL
senior master
member
master
m.youtube.com/watch?v=EGu_VtbpWh...
Francis Collins of the Human Genome Project, former skeptic...now Christian.
Here is a shorter video where Collins gives his Christian testimony and explains that spiritual journey.
m.youtube.com/watch?v=HaEQyNeaFZ...
@AnhedoniaNightmare Wow both of these videos were really great! I pray everyone will watch them. Good work in finding these thank you for sharing my dear brother AnhedoniaNightmare. God bless you!
master
This is why Christians don't bother with reprobates according to Romans 1, for even the TRINITY no longer try as a reprobate is lost.
When witnessing, there are billions to reach, so you as a Christian are like that medic and helping the suffeing who can be helped.
@AnhedoniaNightmare Could you not try and convert the other 5 billion (approx) instead of hanging round this forum because you are certainly not doing a very good job of conversion around here.
I have not seen one baptism/christening in the last month. Actually you may in fact be generating anti-Christian feeling with all your insults etc.
Now, that would be a shame and a little ironic.
You really do need to do some work on the psychology of selling your product and teaching methodology. Plus some social skills if you want to convince anyone of anything.
At the moment, I would not say you could convince your dog to go for a walk with you.
@..box.. How can anyone convert anyone online?
Honestly there is zero hope for reprobates.
senior master
The Band Played Waltzing Matilda - Eric Bogle
When I was a young man I carried me pack
And I lived the free life of the rover
From the Murray's green basin to the dusty outback
I waltzed my Matilda all over
Then in 1915 my country said: Son,
It's time to stop rambling, there's work to be done
So they gave me a tin hat and they gave me a gun
And they sent me away to the war
And the band played Waltzing Matilda
When the ship pulled away from the quay
And amid all the tears, flag waving and cheers
We sailed off for Gallipoli
It well I remember that terrible day
When our blood stained the sand and the water
And how in that hell they call Suvla Bay
We were butchered like lambs at the slaughter
Johnny Turk, he was ready, he primed himself well
He rained us with bullets, and he showered us with shell
And in five minutes flat, we were all blown to hell
He nearly blew us back home to Australia
And the band played Waltzing Matilda
When we stopped to bury our slain
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senior guru
This is what I meant by we do not have free will. Before someone predetermined continuously to do straw man fallacy and start calling names.
@mrkim56 His name is Sam Harris. I am huge fan of his books and public debates. This wasn't a debate though, it was done after his book "free will" got published. But he took few questions. I posted this video link earlier when i stated there is no such thing as free will. Then someone started with no scientific data backing his tales, and started calling me names like brain and vet, slave, etc. I asked like over 50 questions to that person, he never can answer those, at the end he started to post scientific estimates about galaxies, they were long way off. Even the earth population is over 7.7 billion now. But he wouldn't stop.
But I'm glad you like the video. Without judging.
master
I'm amused that atheists have evangelists in the atheist faith based spiritual system.
master
Jesus does command us, but it's not about words but deeds.
m.youtube.com/watch?v=Cz1AVlLAak...
34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: 36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. 37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee ? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? 38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed
thee ? 39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? 40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: 43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. 44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? 45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. 46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
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master
biblehub.com/greek/1228.htm
Jesus (Yeshua in the Hebrew) tells us that Gehenna was intended for the "diabolos" and his angels ie the fallen from Heaven.
There is no indication that it was intended for human beings. Misuse of free will leads to an unnatural conclusion as it was the TRINITY's intention for Jesus to save all.
This word diabolos literally means the slanderer or false accuser as the Ha-Satan(Accuser) was charged to act as a prosecutor yet then rebelled and now falsely accuses humanity even when forgiven of sin. The source of guilt and shame is Helel ben Shahar as all sins can easily be forgiven except the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
This is why YAHWEH removes the sin "as far as the east is from the west" ie is utterly gone. So it is theologically wrong to feel shame and guilt as then that opposes YAHWEH's power and actions.
As soon as a prodigal asks for forgiveness, it is immediate. Jesus removes the heavy burdens that the Pharisees put upon the people's shoulders.
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expert
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top expert
Blessings Friends, Brothers, and Sisters,
I had a question about why is it Jesus commands us to tell others - and then I questioned why me? Well this is the ANSWER:
Before Jesus departed to His heavenly throne to take His position as Lord and Christ, He spent a final time with His eleven disciples. The last command that He gave them was this: "Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age" (Matthew 28:19-20).
If these are the last words that Jesus gave His disciples, we must consider that they are of the utmost importance to Him, and to ourselves. Jesus commands us to tell others about Him. You may ask, "Why me? Aren't there others more equipped to do that? I am not a preacher, I do not know what to say."
The first and foremost reason that we should tell others about Him is that this is His command. The beloved physician, Luke, recorded in Acts 1:8, "But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth."
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